>> A legislator in California has introduced legislation that if it passes will impose prison time on people that fail to use other people’s preferred pronounces. Scott wiener’s bill would impose up to a year in prison for caregivers that fail to use a gender’s specific pronounce. Robin, thanks for coming on. Does and sound American that you go to jail if you say something someone else doesn’t want you to say? Don’t we have a bill of rights to prevent that?
>> Absolutely. The first amendment. I want to expose my own ignorance to this issue. I was ignorant until I read the bill and got informed. What I found out in the bill, it says there was a 2011 survey that is a bit dated. It showed that there were 6,456 respondents and 28% of those suffered harassment from medical providers. 19 — these are lgbt elders. They had been denied care. So that necessitated this bill. Let’s be fair that I think you’re cherry picking because this bill is not just about trans-gender use of pronounces and all of that. It’s about all of lgbt righting included in the patient’s bill of rights.
CARLSON: And I’m sure there’s lots of things I wouldn’t agree with in the bill. To be totally clear, you should call people what they want to be called. You should be polite to people and I try to be. But there’s a principle at stake here that you’re ignoring for political reasons that I’m surprised you are. That is simple. It’s called free speech. You have the right to express your view. If other people don’t like it, they don’t like it. You can’t be put in prison for saying what you think is true. This bill seems to ignore that longstanding right that we’ve enjoyed, and I find it terrifying for that reason.
>> And I knew you were going to say that. I will contend these are employees, regulated by the government. They already have a patients bill of rights that addresses these. What is left out are protections for the lgbt community. They’re already — let’s look at this, tucker. The elderly community is already a marginalized community. Think about the fact if you were lgbt or even like the worst, trans-gender, they’re the most disenfranchised. They’re the most vulnerable. I want to say this. Just consider if you will, I am myself and openly gay. Say 30 years from now I’ve been in a relationship a couple decades and this bill wasn’t in play, it would deny my partner the ability the visit me because a nurse might have a problem with it.
>> Tucker: No. Again, you’re skirting the point I’m making, which this bill criminalizes speech. If you use the wrong word, you can be put in jail. That is grotesque. And I understand that you’re enthusiastic about expanding rights for lgbt elders. Okay? But why in the world would you as an American who once wore the uniform support a bill that would criminalize speech? Because elder abuse is inherently wrong. I will read the bill —
>> Tucker: Slow down. Speech is not abuse.
>> No. I’m talking about abuse. This — understand this. Misusing someone’s pronoun is abuse. We see all the team people do this as a form of abuse. I follow the alt right blogs where they call Michelle Obama a man. That is abusive.
>> Tucker: Should they go to jail for that?
>> No. But if it’s done in a medical thing — hold on. Constituted, tucker, prolonged continuous intentional abuse by a healthcare provider. That is abuse. That should be criminal.
>> Tucker: It should be criminal. Okay. What about thinking it? What if I have unpleasant thoughts about you and you find out I had them. Should guy to jail, too?
>> That’s human nature.
>> Tucker: Oh, human nature. But using the wrong pronounce should — how many — “Abuse” is a subjective term. We’re not talking about physical abuse. We’re saying hearing something —
>> Mental abuse.
>> Tucker: Okay. A subjective category again. How many times would I have to misuse a pronounce before I went to prison?
>> It has to be — I gave you the three criteria. Prolonged, continuous intentional abuse by a health care provider.
>> Tucker: How many times would I have to misuse a pronoun before the police came, handcuffed me and sent me to a prison cell?
>> That’s not just a pronounce. You’re cherry picking.
>> Tucker: I’m not cherry picking. The bill says a lot of things.
>> The bill —
>> Tucker: No, but it also says what I’m saying it says. I’m not making this up. What I care about is the criminalization of speech. I’m asking you a very simple question. How many times do I need to use the wrong pronounce before police with guns show up and handcuff me and deny me of my freedom and throw me in a prison cell? Four times, five times? How many times?
>> I posted the entire bill on my Twitter at robin Biro. You can read the bill. It does not say a number.
>> Tucker: You’re dodging it. Last question. There’s a lot of things that I don’t like to hear. People call me names. I find it abusive. I have mental anguish as a result, let’s say. Should they go to jail for that?
>> If I that are your healthcare provider and they do it intentionally to mentally abuse you and as stated on the wall in the healthcare bill of rights, yes. When —
>> Tucker: These are like minimum wage workers and you’re like, bullying them basically. It’s so weird. I wonder — I hope you watch this tape when this is over and ask yourself — people have their opinions —
>> Listen, like I said, I didn’t used to be on this side of the issue. I read the bill and educated myself. I get it.